68: LaLaurie Mansion
Gina (00:11)
and welcome to I Scream, You Scream, your weekly scoop of the most chilling histories, mysteries, and paranormal perplexities. My name's Gina.
Kathryn (00:20)
And I'm Kathryn.
Gina (00:21)
And this month we have been, and also for today, will be discussing New Orleans while we enjoy some kind of ice cream thing. We'll get into it when we rate our own performance for this month because we tried our best. That's the moral of the story. we to that part though, I do need to give a quick shout out. We have a new Patreon supporter who I am so excited about because it's my cousin Blake.
So shout out Blake. Yes, huge shout out to Blake my cousin as well. They're actually, I think by the time this comes out, they'll have just left New Orleans after taking a trip there. So it's wonderful timing. So happy to have you with us. Yes, we did do this for Jess and Blake specifically.
Kathryn (00:50)
Yay, Blake! Welcome!
perfect timing. We did this for them.
Gina (01:09)
If you would like to join Blake in being a Patreon member, we post some really cool behind the scenes stuff on there, so make sure to check it out. Link is always in the show notes. you could also leave us a review or a rating. And if you send a screenshot of it to iscreamyouscreampod@gmail.com along with your mailing address, we will send you some stickers that you are just bound to love.
But until then, grab a spoon and let's dig in.
Kathryn (01:33)
You
I'm eating with my left hand because Cinnamon's snoozing on my right, so we're going to do my best.
Do you have a rating for this month?
Gina (01:46)
Listen, ⁓ so if you haven't listened to the other ⁓ New Orleans episodes, totally cool, no worries. Podcasts are like a forever content, so you can go back whenever you want. But just to catch you up, Kathryn and I are not on theme. We are doing our best. We set out to have coffee ice cream with some kind of bourbon-y twist. I instead am having espresso flavored mochi and
Kathryn (02:02)
Whoops.
Gina (02:16)
Stroop Waffle Liqueur. And, Kathryn, what are you having?
Kathryn (02:21)
I am having cup of coffee and butter pecan ice cream, which I misread as bourbon pecan ice cream. Yeah. And listen, if you don't have a rating, I do. Because fun fact about me, I hate butter pecan ice cream. I don't hate it.
It's just like of all of the ice cream flavors in the world, I would never choose this over the vast majority of them.
Gina (02:53)
Hmm.
Kathryn (02:57)
But my coffee's good, drinking Colectivo which is a fan favorite, love Colectivo coffee. So that's pulling the weight this month, ice cream itself, I'm giving it a two it's not like the worst thing I've ever had, but I certainly didn't enjoy myself while eating it this month.
Gina (03:01)
Yay, nice.
Now, I mean, I think I'm pretty, I'm on the same page as you. didn't come up with a number rating for mine because it just didn't feel correct. So instead I'm going to give us a gold star because we both made an attempt.
Kathryn (03:25)
Mm-hmm.
Gina (03:33)
And I think especially
Kathryn (03:33)
We did.
Gina (03:34)
this early in the year, it's important to practice gratitude and forgiveness and all that other bullshit. And so we're doing great.
Kathryn (03:41)
Yeah, okay, I like that. Love a gold star.
we'll do better next month.
Gina (03:46)
Yeah, it's still my turn to announce. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Is this like the second month of the three? Okay. Okay.
Kathryn (03:49)
I know.
This is the second. You'll
be off the hook next month, like after next month.
Gina (03:59)
Okay.
Okay, got it. I'll add that to my calendar with a little sparkle and dance emoji next to it. I'm free. But yes, next month, our topic is going to be femme fatales. So excited. I cannot wait for next month. It's gonna be so good. And for our ice cream accompaniment, we're going to go with a kind of a looser prompt of chocolate and berries.
Kathryn (04:02)
That's the real gold star.
Yay! I'm so excited. Yeah.
Gina (04:29)
And we can interpret that how we will.
Kathryn (04:33)
which now I'm kind of nervous because that's what we did this month. But we're gonna, it's gonna, it's March, it's springtime, we're prepared, we already have one under our belt and we will do better. And we will do something at least.
Gina (04:45)
Yes. And if push comes to shove,
like worst case scenario, any old ice cream, throw some chocolate chips and some blueberries in there or something, still works.
Kathryn (04:56)
Okay, yeah, no, that's smart. I wonder if I can figure, maybe I can figure out a way to repurpose my strawberry sherbert.
Gina (04:58)
Thank you.
⁓
With chocolate and berries. You could try.
Kathryn (05:09)
See now I'm there. ⁓ I have an idea dark chocolate there is that the One piece of the rainbow is a raspberry I'm thinking I'll let you all know what is it not is that not what flavor it is? The pink is my raspberry Did you think I meant a literal rainbow?
Gina (05:11)
Dark chocolate could be good.
⁓ sorry, my mind went to like, yeah,
like actual literal rainbows and I was like, well, I've never thought of it that way. Yeah, yeah. I was like, I guess raspberry is in there somewhere. I'd never thought about it that way.
Kathryn (05:32)
Roy G. Bibb, raspberry, orange.
was like, wait, am I wrong? What is it? I thought it was raspberry.
Gina (05:43)
No,
you're 100 % right. Yeah, yeah, that works.
Kathryn (05:46)
Okay.
I Have an update for you
Gina (05:50)
What is your update?
Kathryn (05:52)
I have an update on the convent from the Casket Girls episode. Okay, so trying to think of a better way to describe it. It's not an update to the Casket Girls story or anything like that, but I have updated feelings. And remember, I was disappointed that maybe there wasn't a vampire there.
Gina (05:58)
Okay?
Kathryn (06:16)
I now think there actually is one, unrelated to the Casket Girls. I don't think that they brought the vampire over, but I do think there is one and I will tell you why. So I got coffee with three fourths of the TWATS the other day, which you know about and I've been like saving this to tell you on the podcast because I wanted to update people. So I met with Christina, Kim and Denise. Frankie couldn't be there.
Gina (06:18)
Why?
Yay!
Kathryn (06:43)
He was in New Orleans at the time. yeah, and so they were talking about, ⁓ for context, for everyone listening,
Gina (06:45)
Hey-o!
Kathryn (06:53)
So that episode had not aired yet when I met with them. So this was totally out of context. So I didn't say anything because I was like, wanted to see where the conversation would go. And they mentioned, I don't remember how we got on the topic of the convent, but they mentioned something like an event happening either there or near there or something like that. And they asked me if I was familiar with the convent. And I was like, oh yeah, I don't
Like I didn't like confirm or deny. I mentioned that you and I had just been talking about it and they started talking about how haunted and creepy it really is. And one of the things they mentioned was that story. I don't know if it was the same story. I don't know if this has happened more than once or if it was just the one story where like the shutter opened.
Gina (07:49)
yeah.
Kathryn (07:50)
Do you happen to know just off the top of your head if there was just one story or if that's happened more than one just for my own curiosity because I don't know.
Gina (07:55)
There's
one main story, I think it was like in the 1970s or 80s or something like that, but it wouldn't surprise me if it spun off into lots of stories.
Kathryn (08:02)
That's what I thought.
Yeah, okay. That's kind of the vibe I got, but I wasn't sure. they know people who were down there. They like lived there when it happened. And like, really did fly someone from the Vatican to the convent to close the shutter.
Like no one was, yes, no one was allowed to like go in or whatever. It was like off limits to the public or whatever. And the only person allowed to go in was this like some random person from the Vatican to close it. they, don't remember how they know this person, but they were like there when it happened. And they have all been there. All three of them, they've like been there for events and stuff.
Gina (08:23)
Really?
Kathryn (08:51)
And they said that it's one of those places where like when you go, sound just kind of stops. Like it's one of those places where there's foliage and trees and bushes and everything. You should be able to hear like birds chirping, crickets, like stuff like that. And once you get on the premises, there's literally nothing. It's like a weird, like energetic in between that.
All three of them were like, yeah, it's creepy there, it's weird. like, they didn't know exactly how to describe it, but they knew it was weird and it has like creepy energy. Yeah, and I just, the more they were talking, that's like the whole update, but I was like, wait, this, we like literally were just talking about this, like right before I met with them. So it was wild that it A came up because I didn't know we were going to start talking about New Orleans and like at all.
Gina (09:36)
That's wild!
Kathryn (09:45)
let alone about the convent specifically, which I had never heard of before your episode. So it's wild that that's where the discussion went. ⁓ And so yeah, I'm convinced that there really are demons there.
Gina (09:53)
That is wild.
Okay, I was gonna say either a vampire or like some other kind of demonic thing.
Kathryn (10:02)
Yeah, I think that because this is my new theory, the update is my new theory. And that is I do think there is something demonic going on there that has helped fuel the vampire legend. But I would love if it was a vampire. I am rooting for vampire, but I'm just, ⁓ I don't know for sure. But I do think that there's something.
Gina (10:17)
Okay.
I have so many questions. want, right?
Kathryn (10:31)
I know me too and I
was like, I have follow up questions but I wanted to talk to you about it first because I was just like, I just thought it was so weird that we had just talked about it. And now I feel like this comment is haunting me all the way from afar. I love a comment.
Gina (10:48)
They could,
the Twats could just sense it in you, all this convent stuff.
Kathryn (10:54)
Well, yeah, that too. I'm sure they all were like, all of my vibes and like, okay, this is how we're going to steer this discussion using their psychic abilities.
it was one of those things and like they listened to this podcast, like they're gonna be like, why didn't you just say something? But it's because I was so excited that it was getting brought up so closely after us discussing it that I just wanted to see where the discussion would go. And I was so excited to come back and tell you that I just forgot all follow-up questions. I was mostly excited that they all have had like actual experiences there and they have like felt the energy there.
Gina (11:09)
You
Mm-hmm.
Kathryn (11:32)
Cause that's one thing that I feel like I'm missing in a lot of these stories, especially for my own, where I'm like, if I have an opinion on a place, I'm like, I still haven't been there though. You know what I mean? So, I mean, this is the eternal call to action to everyone. If you have been to any of the places we've discussed, this is why we want you guys to tell us about it. Cause yeah, I was just very excited to hear about the convent nails.
Gina (11:44)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Kathryn (12:01)
twice in one month. I know, right?
Gina (12:01)
The bit that I... You lucky gal. The bit that I can't stop
thinking about is how you mentioned that when you get on the property, you can't even hear crickets chirping. Because we talk all the time about how animals know better than... They can sense things before humans can sense them. But there's something about when it's bugs. You can't even hear a bug that is... I don't know. There's just an extra layer to that.
Kathryn (12:11)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I know.
Yeah, my update, that's all I have.
Gina (12:30)
Anyway, I am dying to hear this story.
Kathryn (12:36)
Okay, I'm honestly kind of scared to tell it to
I left my research on this episode feeling very similar to how I felt when I researched the Cecil Hotel. I... We're gonna see how this goes because it's a very, very interesting story, but it is a very, very dark story. So...
Gina (12:51)
Mmm.
Kathryn (13:05)
I'm gonna start by painting a little French Quarter picture for you. I love when you do it for me and I never do it for you, so I tried this time. In the French Quarter of New Orleans, on a busy stretch of Royal Street, stands a house that has never quite blended in. Architecturally, it might look like any other historic home in the area, but energetically, something is clearly not right.
Gina (13:09)
Okay.
Hooray!
Kathryn (13:33)
People passing by at night often report seeing shadowy figures gliding past the windows, even when they know for a fact that the house is empty.
Others describe the sound of chains dragging along the floors loud enough to be heard from the busy street outside. These, among other accounts, have been claimed by numerous people, even those who don't even know the house's history, which begs the question, has the house's reputation created a communal haunting, or are there really ghosts trapped inside the LaLaurie mansion? So.
Like I said, today is going to get quite a bit dark
actually remembered a content warning, which I never do. So you know it's real when I actually remember to do a content warning upfront. ⁓ I will be discussing pretty severe violence and abuse toward enslaved people and
Also the death of a child and deaths as well, but the death of the child is the most brutal one. So I will be like re-upping the sensor when we get there. And I'm not going to go into extreme detail of all of the abuse, but I will warn you when I get there regardless.
The LaLaurie Mansion has had several owners over the centuries, but to fully understand exactly why it is thought to hold such dark energy, we do need to take a look at its most prominent owner and resident, and that is Marie Delphine LaLaurie who went by Delphine, which, and I'm actually going to like immediately steamroll and bring up, remember?
when we were confused about the Marie Laveau episode and why all of her children were Marie, but they went by their middle name. Same deal. This woman's name was also Marie, but went by Delphine, her middle name. And I tried to look it up. And apparently that was just a thing to like go by your middle name in the 1800s. It was as simple as that. The Marie was just a coincidence. Like usually attributed to Virgin Mary,
Gina (15:23)
yeah.
Okay.
Kathryn (15:45)
because everyone was Catholic down there, so everyone's name was Marie. Just a little tidbit, because we addressed it in the Marie Laveau, so I wanted to bring it up, because we have another Marie, but she went by Delphine. Delphine was born in the French Quarter on March 19th, 1787. She was a Pisces. And she was born during the Spanish colonial period of New Orleans, which lasted from...
Gina (15:48)
All right, that's interesting.
Kathryn (16:10)
Roughly 1762 to 1801, I think. I feel like we've talked a lot about French, colonial, American, et cetera, because it was shifting back and forth a lot in the time frames we were discussing. So if that does not match up with other dates you've heard this month, just ignore it, because it was roughly thereabouts, depending on which source we found for which episode and who was recording those documents. Anyway, OK.
Gina (16:21)
Yeah.
Kathryn (16:40)
so Delphine's parents were prominent members of the European Creole community and she had several extended family members who were pretty important in the city, ⁓ including but not limited to one uncle who would become mayor in 1850. So her family was kind of like the who's who among the, socialites and elite in New Orleans.
And that's kind of why another reason I mentioned Marie Laveau is because they would have crossed paths. Like it's very possible that even if they didn't know each other, they definitely would have known of each other. Just doesn't that blow your mind? That's why I wanted to bring it up because that's very much one of those time doesn't make sense type of things. Yeah, they would have, she would have been, what did I say?
Gina (17:13)
⁓ God.
that blows my mind. I had never thought about that. my God.
No.
Kathryn (17:34)
She would have been what 13, 14 when Marie Laveau was born. It's like fully possible she could have been like one of the women in Marie Laveau's salon. It was like, isn't that weird? Yeah, I know. It really does. Yes, I agree.
Gina (17:46)
that makes me uncomfortable. I don't like that. Mmm.
Kathryn (17:51)
So before we get into Delphine's socialite status as an adult, we need to talk about the Haitian Revolution, which was going on when she was younger and before she was born, because it had a pretty big influence on the events of this story. warning, this is going to be a huge summary. Otherwise, we could do an entire podcast just on this.
If you are a history person and expert in the Haitian Revolution, please be nice. This is very much just a summary of the situation.
But just to give some context, the Haitian revolution started with an uprising of enslaved people in what was previously the French colony of, I don't know how to pronounce this, so sorry, Domingue? Domingue? I don't know. Whatever it was called before, it was called Haiti. ⁓ Extremely long story short, these enslaved people basically band together and revolted and there was a revolutionary war.
Gina (18:44)
Yeah.
Kathryn (18:57)
with the colonizers and slave owners and ultimately they did gain their own freedom. And that ultimately led to Haiti becoming an independent state and slavery was abolished. Though forced labor was not abolished slash illegal, which is like a whole other thing and kind of, I know it like, it's like.
Gina (19:18)
What? Okay.
Kathryn (19:21)
Yes, slavery, quote unquote, was abolished, but you were still able to like force someone to work for you for very, very, very little pay. That was the difference. So basically it still sucked and shit was still awful, but they were technically free. This led to a lot of people ⁓ fleeing. one of the closest places to go would have been
Gina (19:28)
You just wouldn't... Okay, got it,
Great.
Kathryn (19:50)
the Gulf Coast, specifically New Orleans. So there was a huge influx of people coming in from Haiti after they gained their freedom and ultimately settling in New Orleans. This is another kind of crossover with Marie Laveau because that's where Marie's husband came from. He was like a revolutionary from Haiti. That's how they ended up together. So.
Gina (20:09)
Mmm.
Kathryn (20:16)
While all of this was happening down in what would become Haiti, word began to spread. Like I said, a lot of people were coming up to the American colonies states and what have you, whatever was going around down there at that time. don't know. America was like not the America we know today yet, ⁓ but would be around this time. people would come up from Haiti and
Gina (20:31)
Hahahaha
Kathryn (20:41)
word was spreading that all of these enslaved people were revolting. And that made white people, particularly slaveholders, very scared that the people they had in their home were going to get wind of what was happening, get a little too brave, start thinking for themselves a little bit too much, and then get some funny ideas and break free.
as a result of these people being afraid that the people in their home were going to try to break free, abuse of enslaved people increased significantly around this time. Like it kind of turned into a, you know, if you try anything funny, look what's going to happen to you type of situation. So really, really dark time, particularly
The reason I bring all of this up in relation to Delphine's family ⁓ is her uncle died during one of these revolts. And as the story goes, it was quote unquote, the fault of the revolting slaves. Of course, if we look at it objectively, that's not necessarily how it goes, but that is the story passed amongst the white slaveholders at the time. So Delphine grew up in a family where like,
Gina (21:52)
Hmm.
Kathryn (22:01)
they were the bad guy and, you know, they were not worth treating properly and, you know, whatever. We'll get into all of the rules and regulations on ⁓ having slaves in a household in a bit, but just know that this is of the framework through which this woman viewed having slaves in her home and that, like, that shit never ends well. So.
Fast forward to when she is of marrying age, which at this time was 13 years old. Yep. So she gets married for the first time at the age of 13 she married a high ranking Spanish royal officer, just like one ick after another. Four years after they got married, he died while they were sailing to Havana, Cuba.
Gina (22:34)
my gosh. ⁓
Wow.
Kathryn (22:54)
while she was pregnant with their first child, which she would give birth to shortly after his death. So she was 17 at that time. And in 1808, when she was 21, she married her second husband, who this doesn't really matter to the story, but I wanted to mention he was a banker, merchant, lawyer, and legislator. I just wanted to bring that up because it made me laugh a little bit. It's giving Barbie vibes. Why does he have so many jobs?
I just like again, this has nothing to do with the story that just like I don't know why he had so many jobs iscreamyouscreampod@gmail.com Why did Delphine LaLaurie's second husband have so many jobs? ⁓ They would have four children together until his death in 1816 and after her second husband died he left her with a pretty significant debt because she came from money
Gina (23:26)
Ha ha.
You
Kathryn (23:53)
and she was in that upper class orbit. I don't really know what like debt means in that regard, because I feel like debts are kind of malleable. At that point, it's just like favors and shit, you know what I mean? So even though she was in significant debt, she was still fine for the next several years. And she just kind of carried on socializing and like being in the upper class until her father's death in 1824, which left her
Gina (24:00)
Mmm.
Yeah.
Kathryn (24:22)
with a significant chunk of change. So she was basically set for life after that, once she got that inheritance. So then after that, when she was set with all this money again, she would marry her third and final husband the following year after her father died, a man 15 years her junior named Dr. Leonard Louis Nicolas LaLaurie.
Gina (24:51)
Hmm.
Kathryn (24:51)
So yes, I thought that was interesting, kind of starting to like see who she is in her elder years. I feel like she is power dynamic that she is, yeah.
Gina (25:04)
Yeah.
Cause how old would she have been when she married this guy? Ish. Sorry, like ballpark.
Kathryn (25:11)
Oh God, you're asking me to do math? Okay, so she got married when
she, when was she born? I did say her birth year. Let me scroll. Okay, so she was born in 87, 1787, and then she married him.
in 1824.
Gina (25:30)
So almost 40. So that's like when a 15 year age gap, there would have been, he would have been like less, I don't know if cognitively developed is the right word, but he would have been like early 20s, like partying years, which I'm sure it was different back then. But what did they say? Like your brain doesn't finish developing until you're like 25 or something?
Kathryn (25:32)
Okay.
was gonna say, yeah, yeah.
but he was like a full blown doctor. Dude, time is weird. Like, time is not the same as it was in the 1800s, thinking of like a 20-something year old, which I guess doctors are in their 20s, I guess. But early 20s, you're still in like biology 102 at that time. Get away from me with that scalpel. Are you kidding? Yeah.
Gina (25:55)
No.
early 20s? 22?
Yeah, you're still drinking jungle
juice at that age. Bring it back!
Kathryn (26:17)
But
in 1831, he was a practicing physician.
Gina (26:22)
⁓ Mm-hmm.
Kathryn (26:26)
So
yes, she, also think like I, I totally forgot his name the whole rest of this time, I refer to him as her husband because she like very much runs the show. She purchased that house with the money she was left. Like he was just kind of along for the ride. It was her property, her home. You know, she kind of ran the show. ⁓ It was just.
a years after they got married. So in 1831, she bought the corner plot at 1140 Royal Street. And that's where they would build the mansion that would become known as the LaLaurie Mansion.
It is sad that right from the jump, the energy in the home was just not good.
house was barely built before Delphine filed for legal separation from Louis, claiming that he, quote, treated her in such a manner as to render their living together unsupportable. And that claim was corroborated by two of their daughters who did live with them at the time. They were still living with her.
Gina (27:28)
Okay.
Kathryn (27:38)
There's not a lot of information on the relationship that can be used to verify whether or not there was something going on. If he was abusive to her, or if she was abusive to him, or whatever it may be, there just really isn't a lot of documented evidence other than this file for separation.
were some sources that did claim that everything was fine between them and they seemed to get along just fine. I don't want to say they had like a loving, happy, wonderful, blissful relationship, but there didn't seem to be any indication that anything was wrong until they moved into this house, essentially.
In addition to the crumbling of their relationship, it was around this time about when the mansion was first built and like after they were all moved in and everything that rumors about Delphine's mistreatment of the enslaved people in her home started circulating and
I want to clarify the only reason I'm saying the word rumor at this point in the story is because between the years 1831 and 1834, the claims of severe mistreatment from Delphine vary widely. So the rumor was not whether or not she was mistreating them. It was specifically how she was mistreating them. So people, you know, were coming up with stories and there were like whispers about
Gina (29:02)
Mmm.
Kathryn (29:09)
the people living in Delphine's home and what she could have been doing to them and ⁓ what she wasn't doing for them, things like that. We don't know exactly what was going on. And spoiler alert, we will never know exactly what was going on in that house, but we do have stories of, certain things that we do know for sure. We will get into them here in a second, but.
I will say there are several stories that do have eyewitnesses and then other stories that are just conjecture. Is that the word? my god, that feels so not right. ⁓ my mouth did not like that. Conjecture? Ew. ⁓ conjecture.
Gina (29:47)
Mm-hmm, yeah. ⁓
I guess it is a weird word, conjecture.
Kathryn (29:57)
I do not like the word conjecture at all. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I just could not. I'm sorry. You can edit that out if you want. just like literally my mind is blown. I did not realize I hated that word. Okay, conjecture. Okay.
Gina (30:00)
I do not like that word.
Hehehehe
You
Kathryn (30:18)
So yeah, we can confirm some things, but just not all the things. That's what I'm trying to get at here. For example, one of the things that we can use to confirm what may or may not have happened are like funeral slash death records from that time, because we would later come to find out that there were a minimum of 12.
deaths within the LaLaurie home between the years 1830 and 1834. Four years, well five years, yeah. So the whole reason these stories started to spread and why we were looking into death records in the first place, this is where we're going to give the content warning again.
Gina (30:53)
⁓
Kathryn (31:10)
One day, neighbors said that they saw an enslaved girl somewhere between the ages of 8 to 12. The stories would differ as the years went on. I think the original story was 8. And then as the years went on, it was suspected that she was just malnourished. So she was likely closer to 12. Neighbors saw her running from Delphine on the roof of the house. And Delphine was chasing her with a whip. And
Gina (31:27)
⁓
Kathryn (31:38)
Either the girl slipped and fell or jumped to get away from Delphine and she did subsequently die. Some versions of the story state that the girl had been brushing Delphine's hair and she hit like a snag or a tangle or something, which hurt Delphine and infuriated her and made her mad. So she grabbed the whip and started chasing her around. But this...
hair combing story didn't pop up until several years later. So we don't know if it was someone heard it from someone who heard it from someone else, or if this was just part of the legend that people needed answers as to why this would happen. So they made it up. We just don't know for sure. ⁓ What is true and what we do know is the child's body would later be found buried in the yard amongst
others,
were they looking in Delphine's yard where they could like eventually find this girl? in 1834 there was a fire on the property that the fire and police department were called out to. And it took a while for the LaLauries to let them into the house.
And there are a couple of notable things here. One is Delphine's husband was still on the premises during this fire, had filed for legal separation at that point. So a lot of people were thinking, why would he still be at this home? Some people say that
It was just a matter of dynamics at the time, obviously, whether or not a woman purchased things for herself. The man of the house was still the man of the house, so he didn't need to leave. Other people use this as fuel for the kind of bad energy of the home. And this has turned into more of a, once you're at this house, you never leave type story.
But that's just an aside. going to re-up the content warning here.
So like I said, they're not letting them into the home. So that's like suspicious as hell. You your house is burning to the ground and you're not letting people into your home. So they bust their way in and they discover that the fire has started in the kitchen.
also found in the kitchen, the cook of the home chained to the oven. And when she was questioned, she said that that is where she was kept.
24-7 day and night every single day all the time and If any of her children who were also enslaved in the home on the property they if they ever tried to like bring her food or water or like Talk to her keep to keep her company or anything like that. They would be badly beaten and so would she so
As a result, she admitted to the fire department that she's the one that started the fire in an attempt of suicide. Yeah. Yeah. And it does get worse. So I am re-upping the content warning.
In addition to the cook, the firefighters found a horrific scene, particularly in the attic. So more content warnings. They found people with iron collars around their necks and they weren't just like, I hate saying this, but they weren't just like your average iron collars. They had like spikes in them so they couldn't move too much or else they would be.
What's the word I'm looking for? Basically, they'd get puncture wounds if they moved too much. Others were bound in really uncomfortable and painful and unnatural positions. And it was clear that they had been there for a while. also speculated, I don't know if they confirmed that she had people in cages or if that was just part of the later stories.
but a lot of people do say that she did have people in cages up there. A lot of people had like really gnarly injuries, she was using more than just whips on them. I'm just gonna say that. It was just horrific.
In the following days, I think it was the day after the New Orleans Bee, which was a newspaper at the time, reported that people were, suspended by the neck with their limbs apparently stretched and torn from one extremity to the other. So as, like, detailed as I'm going to go in how people were found.
There might be some more content warnings later, but that's the bulk of it just to let everyone know. obviously, after all of this comes to light and all these people are found, an investigation was opened on Delphine and her husband. But again, mostly Delphine because it was her property. Like she legally owned the home and therefore per Louisiana law at the time, the people inside of it. So this wasn't like these weren't their enslaved people.
They were like, quote unquote, hers. So once word got out about, you know, what everyone saw and the fact that there was an investigation into Delphine and people were starting to hear what she had done, New Orleans residents went absolutely berserk.
They were so mad and disgusted with her and just hearing what she had done that a literal mob descended on the home and they busted down the door and were ransacking the place and tearing shit up and literally knocking down the walls and stuff like that. It was very like...
angry town mob mentality situation. I hate saying this, but I'm imagining like the Beauty and the Beast situation where everyone was just like, that's like literally how it was described. Right. And they essentially ran her out of town. she like everyone was mad. And this is why going back to the beginning, this is why I say it's very likely that Marie Laveau had heard of her because this was
Gina (37:48)
That's what I was picturing.
Kathryn (38:03)
news. This was like national news. People were like horrified at what she had done. ⁓ So she, in response, fled to Paris to hide out for the rest of her life. I know. Yeah, she was exiled in Paris. She never did come back.
Gina (38:14)
⁓ what a horrific punishment for her crimes.
Kathryn (38:21)
Like I said, she was exiled for the rest of her life. And once the authorities started questioning people, it was clear that she had been mistreating people in her home pretty much since the house was built. And this is, again, where the discussion of was there quote unquote something dark on this property in this home or had she always been doing this? And it was just when they moved somewhere.
more like prominent and visible or whatever that it came to light. I do not know and I don't have a full opinion on that. 100 % believe that this property is cursed and haunted
Whatever version of the story, I don't care. It's horrific either way. takeaway is it was clear that it had been happening for at least the duration of her being in the house. everything from here on out is just conjecture or whatever. ⁓
Sorry, I had it my notes again, so I had to say it one more time. Am I even using that word correctly? Okay, just making sure.
Gina (39:25)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, I think so. Because it just means like we don't
we don't know for sure, but it is supposed.
Kathryn (39:30)
Okay, I'm just questioning
everything about that word now. right.
So a lot of the stories about the abuse within the home has been sensationalized a little bit. Like we mentioned earlier.
And I want to talk about it because I was trying to figure out why, things got sensationalized after everything happened when what happened was already so horrific.
Another quick content warning, even though what I'm about to say next isn't like verified stuff that happened, ⁓ it is still pretty brutal. So, you know, just fair warning. are stories about ⁓ people's... This is actually like...
I do want to emphasize that everything I'm about to say likely did not happen. I'll explain that more in a little bit. But there are stories about people's mouths being sewn shut and that was like the way people would explain why they were so like emaciated versus just I don't want to say just but versus like she just chose not to feed them.
There were stories about essentially them quote unquote experimenting on people. So one of the biggest ones that you've likely heard about was that
she would, like, detach someone's arm and reattach it onto someone else's arm to make, like, quote unquote creatures. I don't know, just really, really horrendously barbaric things. As awful as that is,
Gina (41:01)
Mm.
Kathryn (41:12)
I will say the furthest back that we can trace these particular stories which is about 90 years after it happened. the furthest back, like the original place that it can be traced to was on a, essentially the equivalent of like a haunted New Orleans tour. So.
Gina (41:25)
Hmm.
Kathryn (41:40)
it's very likely that these extremely, extremely, extremely gruesome stories were just legends that the original story kind of got turned into. ⁓ And that's the part that I kind of wanted to look into a little bit more because again, like the original story is so horrific and so barbaric,
essentially what I'm trying to get at is people being in chains wasn't going to sell ghost tour tickets. I'm just going to say it frankly. So it's very likely that people started like taking the fact that her husband was a doctor.
and turning that into the ghost story. You know what I mean? And like kind of like a H.H. Holmes house of horror type of situation. but a lot of the articles that I found kind of expressed a little bit of surprise in the way her community members reacted. again, it's because we already know that
Gina (42:22)
Mmm.
Yeah.
Kathryn (42:42)
enslaved people were treated horrifically. like people being in chains was not uncommon. People, you know, being whipped and being hurt and all of these things was not against any rules. So it kind of begged to the question, like, why were the community members? I don't want to say why were they so upset because like we know why they're so upset, but relative to the mid 19th century.
it can be a little bit confusing when it's not paired with these more sensational versions of the stories.
And while I was searching for like some context to explain why in particular the people of Louisiana understood this to be barbaric when like other parts of the country were genuinely treating enslaved people this badly, I came across ⁓ information on the black codes. Are you familiar with black codes? Okay.
Gina (43:44)
No.
Kathryn (43:46)
I've heard of them. I'm like embarrassed to say I like didn't know this much about them. It's something we all should know about. So highly recommend you look into them. I'm gonna give a background, but all of us should look into this because it's very important, very relevant. ⁓ I will say the context in which I have heard of them before, but did not fully understand them is like a post-Civil War reconstruction era type thing.
Gina (43:54)
Okay.
Kathryn (44:15)
that context, it was basically a set of laws where were specifically designed to limit the type and amount of freedom that essentially black people had in America. post-Civil War, yes, people in America were technically free, but based on the black codes,
people were allowed to hire enslaved people for significantly less than white people. So it was pretty much the same thing as the Haitian Revolution where, yes, you were free, but at what cost? But they didn't start as a Reconstruction era law.
Louisiana's earliest version of their Black Code was created in 1724 while it was still under French rule. Yeah, pre-American Revolution, yes.
Gina (45:05)
my God. Wow, okay.
Kathryn (45:10)
It was basically meant to give enslaved people just enough protection for them essentially to not want to revolt. If I could like summarize in that way. So the idea was if you treat them just well enough, you remain safe and arguably more importantly at this time, the person, the enslaved person would remain valuable because
they wouldn't have any reason to like revolt or break free and therefore the person who formerly had them in their home wouldn't lose out on that free labor basically. So I know, right? And again, like everyone needs to look into this because this is very much a summary, but that's the gist. And the earliest version of this black code in Louisiana specifically, all territories and states and all
Gina (45:52)
well thank God.
Kathryn (46:09)
like all of that had their own.
three main guidelines in the earliest version of Louisiana's Black Code stated the following. One, slaveholders were required to baptize them in the Catholic faith and subsequently to give them Sundays off for worship. So everyone had to have Sundays off no matter what. Number two, enslaved people were allowed to marry and it was illegal for families to be separated. So if someone
had a family in your home, you weren't allowed to like get rid of anyone or separate them or anything like that. And number three, and most important to our story, they were forbidden from quote, severe mistreatment. And this was the key to like, again, keeping them just happy enough, but like you were allowed to mistreat them a little bit per this code.
So that last one's quite ambiguous. Where is the line between punishment, mistreatment, and straight-up torture? It was all relative extremely blurry,
really was completely subjective and like up to whoever was enforcing these codes. The codes would change quite a bit as you know, the years and decades and stuff went on depending on who owned the territory quote unquote at the time. There's a lot more to this, but for the purposes of this story, because the lines were so blurry as to how people like should actually be treated,
As word spread and as the years went on, that's kind of why people's perspective of this story changed because at the time, Louisiana's black codes were a little bit more, I'm gonna say lenient. Like the word that was used to describe them in comparison to other states was generous. Like other states were a lot harsher to.
⁓ enslaved people. So through the lens of other states, people were kind of like, all right, well, did what she do? Like, was it actually so bad? Like, did the people deserve it? You know, like, that's kind of the discussion that was being had around it. And that's where the rumors of the abuse being so much more like straight up horror story kind of started.
were a, again, I'm going to say relatively more progressive city in regards to the treatment of enslaved people. They were able to see like this real abuse that was happening and see it for what it was and see it as the torture it actually was.
the reality was compared to other states in the union at the time, Louisiana did have a more lenient black code than other places. Despite this fact, what was not more lenient was the legal punishment toward enslaved people if they did anything wrong.
So the idea was kind of like, we as citizens need to treat the enslaved people well, but the law did not, basically. So that kind of created this ⁓ weird, not full understanding of how people were or were not allowed to be treated in general. And this is a big reason why the rumors kind of just got out of hand because compared to other states,
like the abuse that she inflicted on these people just, it could have been anything basically in the eyes of other states. Like people just heard about this barbaric woman and the rumors went flying. ⁓ But at its core, despite all of the other horrific rumors that were spread about her, what is true is she did torture people regardless of
what is said actually happened in the attic. We do know that she mistreated people and treated them very poorly and straight up, like, physically tortured them. whatever stories you've heard, At the end of the day, that is what's true. The original house, the original LaLaurie Mansion did not survive the mob attack.
and it sat as rubble for years. Like nobody wanted to touch that lot. No one would buy it. Nobody wanted
to even auction it off, like it just sat there ignored. Like nobody wanted to address it at all. Eventually it was purchased. I think it was like five-ish years after Delphine left, so around 1840. And then over the next several decades, it would serve as a public high school, a music conservatory, an apartment building, a reformatory, a bar, a furniture store.
and a luxury apartment building before it became just a mansion, like a full single family home again. it is said that no one who has had ownership of the house the last several decades stays there for long. And there are rumors that that is part of the quote unquote curse, like whoever owns this home.
something will happen and either they lose it or they shut down or what have you. one of the relatively recent examples of this is a celebrity who purchased the home in 2007. Do you know about this? OK. kind of want you to guess, but like, it could be literally anyone if you don't know. It's OK if you don't want to. You want me to just tell you? I just think it's very funny.
Gina (51:46)
No, who bought it?
⁓ God.
Yeah.
Kathryn (51:56)
within
the confines of this story, this horrific story, this is like the most random thing, it's Nicolas Cage. Yeah, while there, I'll tell you why. Nicolas Cage purchased this house with the intention of like holing up in it to write a horror movie or not a horror movie, a horror novel. Yeah, he was straight up gonna Stephen King this situation.
Gina (52:00)
What is it, like Jerry Seinfeld or something?
Why? Well, I guess he's Nicolas Cage.
⁓ wow.
Kathryn (52:24)
⁓ But he didn't because he experienced a significant financial crisis immediately after purchasing it and it went into foreclosure two years later.
Gina (52:32)
Hmm.
I thought you were gonna say he experienced a significant like haunting or something.
Kathryn (52:37)
Yeah.
No, because he was never there because he like couldn't afford to be there. Yeah. Well, and that's so that's interesting because I was really expecting to read about a lot of hauntings that occurred in the home. And there's really next to none because any time anyone owns this home, they are literally never physically there. So the person who purchased it from
Gina (52:44)
Okay.
Wow.
Yeah.
Kathryn (53:11)
Nicolas Cage or from the bank who took it from Nicolas Cage. Sorry, Nick, but that's what happened. So it was purchased in 2009 by a guy. was like he's like an energy gas investor, guys, just someone with money to burn. And he spent the last he spent several years refurbishing it and like updating it and turning it into this big giant mansion.
And he was never there, not a single time. He never was actually at the property. He just hired out all of the updates to people locally and then He sold it to an anonymous entity in 2024. And no one knows who. Yeah, it is speculated that it is likely a ghost tour company of some sort.
Gina (53:51)
An anonymous entity.
⁓
Kathryn (54:02)
but it's just not, it has not been discussed who it is.
Gina (54:06)
What if it's Nicolas Cage again? He's like, I mean it this time.
Kathryn (54:08)
Dude, I kind of want it to be. I really do. And he's like, I'm ready. I got the money. People like me now. Everything's fine.
that's one of the things that has kind of created this mystique around this house, because we know that horrible dark things happened there, and we know that there is dark energy around this place. And we know that well before any of this,
15, 20 year renovation took place. was always kind of mysterious, but that just kind of adds to it. Like why, why did we take so long to refurbish this just to like never be there and never do anything with it, but sell it? ⁓ Granted, it's a huge place. Maybe it does actually take that much time to redo something like this, but either way, there's still very few stories from within the home.
All of them seem to be from the outside. Like I said, people will see the shadows of people walking by the window. And the face in the window. It's specifically a shadow, like a very dark something. either people will say they can see like the silhouette of someone or they can see just like a misty type shadow, but it's never, you can never see the person.
which I feel like is so much darker and more ominous
also I hate this just all of the hauntings that come from this place like all of the stories that come from this place I just it's just so dark. I hate it so much. There's claims of people hearing screaming coming from inside the house Even though again, no one's there like they know that no one's there and it's not like
It's not the sound of someone screaming in the house. It's a more ambient, you can tell that it's not a real human kind of screaming. Also reports of the sound of children crying in and around the property. it is said that if you're walking by, sometimes you will get a brief whiff of a burning fire. that one
the context of what happened at this house and like knowing that that is, that energy is still there, really hate that.
Whether or not you believe the house is cursed, it is definitely extremely haunted. I believe that for a fact. That's one of those places I know we mentioned at the top of this episode.
Like, we aren't in these places. We don't know what the energy is like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. This one, based on everything I've heard and everything I looked into, 100 % confident that this one's super haunted. regardless of what you believe, I think the energy is just too big for.
it to just be a story. I'm like fully on board with this one being absolutely haunted. And it scares me.
Gina (57:01)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, that is so deeply sinister.
Kathryn (57:08)
I know, and this was like the edited version of like everything I found. Yeah.
Sorry, I'm gonna take my... I know, before we like move on, let's just take a second.
Gina (57:18)
I just, I need some deep cleansing breaths.
Yeah, that was, it was interesting, like painful, but interesting. didn't know that some of it was sensationalized. Cause I had heard about the kind of limb displacement part of it. And I just always thought that that was like a verified thing. So it's interesting to know that it doesn't, like you were saying, it does not.
Kathryn (57:36)
Mm-hmm.
Gina (57:47)
like improve or change my opinion of Delphine by even a single shade. Like I still absolutely hate that woman. Like, and what she was doing was on par with the rumors that were flying around. So it's still shit, but that is interesting. And I need to do research on black codes
Kathryn (57:52)
Yeah.
For sure.
Yeah. Well, and that's why I brought up the bit about black codes because I didn't want to talk about things being sensationalized because I definitely do not want the message to be, hey, it wasn't that bad because it was. It was just different than what actually happened, which was still awful, you know? And the reason why is interesting to me. Like, I feel like there is an...
Gina (58:19)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Kathryn (58:35)
⁓ an undiscussed
Like, how do we make this worse so that we can almost feel better about the fact that no one did anything for some reason? Like, there's something weird there that I can't put my finger on and am not able to articulate. ⁓ But that was the best I could do. ⁓
Gina (58:44)
Yeah.
Yeah.
And to be honest,
thank you for doing that research. Because, my God, are you okay? I love you. Yeah.
Kathryn (59:01)
You're welcome.
Yeah, this one sucked. Listen,
I'm a little nervous because I do think in the last episode, not the last episode, but maybe my last episode, I think I made a comment on saying our last two episodes were a little more fun because they weren't as historical. And then I was like, the more I read about this, I don't know if I did say fun. I definitely know we talked more about it being like a straight ghost story.
versus like a historical story and this one was both in a bad way. So sorry. Sorry everyone.
Gina (59:41)
Well, if it would make you feel more comfortable, can change the subject.
Kathryn (59:45)
I would love for you to change the subject.
Gina (59:47)
Okay,
for today's Scary on Top, I thought we could talk about a podcast that I recommended in the Enfield Horror episode back in January that you have now listened to, which is Beth's Dead. So quick warning, if you listening have not listened to Beth's Dead yet, we will be giving spoilers. So if you want to go listen to it first, go check it out. We'll put the link in the show notes. Otherwise, proceed at your own risk.
Kathryn (1:00:02)
Yes.
Gina (1:00:15)
So what'd think, Kathryn?
Kathryn (1:00:17)
This podcast stressed me out so much, but I was obsessed. I felt like I was on the scariest roller coaster of my life, first and
And I feel like I still have not reached a point where I can speak about this coherently. All of this is to say, highly recommend. feel like I can't say I loved it, but not in a bad way. Like I hated my experience listening to it and could not stop listening to it and recommend it to everyone, but also was horrifically uncomfortable and scared the whole time.
Gina (1:00:31)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Kathryn (1:00:53)
⁓ So yeah, hated it. Ten out ten stars. Don't know what else to say. It was a wild journey.
Gina (1:00:57)
Hahaha!
Kathryn (1:01:01)
Should we just for those who have not listened and don't care about spoilers, what's like a good summary for this podcast?
Gina (1:01:05)
That's yeah.
So
I think a good summary might be it's an interview style podcast with Monica from Armchair Expert interviewing Elizabeth and Andy, who are a married couple who used to have a few podcasts back in the day. And they stopped having one specific podcast because something really scary happened with a listener where they were essentially catfished ⁓ really aggressively and very invasively through
Kathryn (1:01:18)
Mm-hmm.
Gina (1:01:36)
one person pretending to be multiple different characters that would interact with Elizabeth and Andy. And the podcast kind of explores what that story is, how they figured out they were being catfished, how they kind of, it's very like detective-y style, how they put the pieces of it together and they explore the impact that it's had on them. And then the big moment, which this is like a mega spoiler, is that they actually wind up
Kathryn (1:01:41)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Gina (1:02:05)
confronting the person who catfished them. So they did figure out who it was and the podcast kind of ends with them on a call with this person discussing what happened and why and getting some closure. And then I think the last episode is kind of a debrief. That was a very long summary, but that's the gist.
Kathryn (1:02:10)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And I
will add one other thing because this heavily contributed to my experience with it. The person that ended up being allegedly was not who they thought it was.
Gina (1:02:34)
Mmm.
Kathryn (1:02:40)
and I have thoughts on that. And I'm struggling so hard. Okay, one, I will back up and not talk about that yet. One, my initial reaction to listening to this podcast was I...
Gina (1:02:41)
Okay?
Kathryn (1:02:55)
I and I will explain myself, I promise. I did approach this from a very victim blame mentality, my own self. I was judging Elizabeth real hard at the beginning. And I like was trying to figure out why I was feeling that way because that's like not really like me. So I was like, why am I judging Elizabeth so hard? And it's because
Gina (1:03:18)
Mm-mm.
Kathryn (1:03:23)
The only thing that I would change about your summary is they were not interacting with Andy and Elizabeth, they were interacting with Elizabeth.
Gina (1:03:29)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, good point.
Kathryn (1:03:32)
Between the two of us as podcasters, I interact with listeners a lot more than you do, just in the nature of the way our jobs fall, very similar to Andy and Elizabeth. so I was very much viewing it from a, like,
Gina (1:03:39)
Mm-hmm.
Kathryn (1:03:47)
Self-preservation this couldn't happen to me because I would never have like gotten that deep like that was my experience with this I Will say right up front none of that is true. I am totally susceptible to all of this
Gina (1:03:51)
⁓ yeah.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.
Kathryn (1:04:02)
I mean, I was fully judgy toward Elizabeth, but like aware of that and I understand why and it was not personal and I had no reason to actually judge her, but the whole first half of it, that was how I was viewing it. I was very much like, you know, when she was reading her emails back and she was kind of laughing like, my God, why would I say all of this? Like knowing now that it wasn't as it seemed, I'm...
Like my reactions were like, yeah, why would you say that knowing full well that I 100 % would like do the same thing. You know what I mean? So that was my first knee jerk
Gina (1:04:37)
Yeah.
the victim blamey stuff, because I think it came across to me like Andy and Monica were doing a lot of that too. And Elizabeth herself seemed to be blaming herself for a lot of what happened. But one thing I, yeah, yeah, agreed. But one thing I appreciated about the podcast is that they left that stuff in there.
Kathryn (1:04:54)
Yeah, she did. Yeah, like too much. So yeah, absolutely.
Gina (1:05:05)
because it would have been very easy for them to edit it out and make it seem like they all...
Kathryn (1:05:06)
Mm-hmm.
Gina (1:05:10)
were just above having knee-jerk reactions like that. And I feel like they didn't shy away from just genuinely trying to understand what the situation was and what Elizabeth was going through during that period. And I think conversations like that are just genuinely like uncomfortable and difficult. And so they can feel much more aggressive and blamey than they actually are.
Kathryn (1:05:14)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah, I agree.
Gina (1:05:39)
That's
where I landed with it.
Kathryn (1:05:41)
I agree with that. I appreciated how in real time the podcast was because that's hard to do. And I think that that's why so many people had trouble with the end. And I say that because like the comments on the final episode are not nice. Like people, yeah, people were going through it and I was as well, weren't like mean, but it was kind of like a, you know.
Gina (1:05:59)
I haven't read them.
Kathryn (1:06:09)
What? That's it? Like blah, blah. And it's like, yeah, because that's like actually the way it played out. You don't know. Like they didn't know going into this how the ending would play out. that note, though, I do have another critique, and this is a small one. This is just it just happens to be a personal pet peeve of mine.
Gina (1:06:18)
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
Kathryn (1:06:29)
What I'm gonna say is gonna make me sound ⁓ victim blaming again. And I promise I'm not coming at it from this perspective. But one thing that they kept saying every time, like toward the end when we were like getting the plot twist and things were unfolding, they kept saying, you know, my gosh, this is so crazy. Like we couldn't make, we couldn't even make this up. We couldn't even make this up.
And every one of those people on the podcast is a self-proclaimed writer.
So just emotionally knee-jerk reaction is yes, you could. So like in them saying that, immediately my body is like, did you? Did you make this up? You can tell me. It's okay. Did you? Like that's immediately where my brain goes because yes, you could.
Gina (1:07:20)
Mm-hmm. ⁓
Kathryn (1:07:31)
I am not saying that she did or that they did or anything like that. It's just the moment someone says that, I'm like, and I've said that, you know what I mean? Like I get that it's a thing people say, but it just like planted this seed. It kind of reminded me of the Enfield horror story where like the more you buckle down on something being true,
without giving anyone an inch of space for doubt. I'm like, okay, but is it true? I don't know.
Gina (1:07:58)
Mmm.
Kathryn (1:08:08)
Cinnamon doesn't know either. I don't know. just, it just, I feel like it happened so quickly because it's such a bingeable podcast. And I know in reality it was not happening that fast for them, but my emotions were so like up and down and all over the place that by the time we got to the twist, I was like, I don't even know what's real anymore. I literally don't know what's happening right now. Like I'm still trying to figure out like.
Gina (1:08:17)
Yeah.
Kathryn (1:08:35)
they being lied to? Are they being catfished now when he was admitting to what he did? Was it really him? I genuinely don't know. I believe it because they believe it and this is their story and I'm not, I am not actually accusing them of lying or anything like that. It's, I'm just describing what my emotions are doing. Like it is a wild ride.
Gina (1:08:41)
Mm-hmm.
at one point, it was before you, you were like in the middle of listening to it. I think you were maybe on the third to last episode or something and you texted me about it. I can't remember what you said, but it was something like, I stayed up until 3 a.m. last night listening to this podcast. can't stop. And that's the exact energy of it. Like you can't stop listening to it.
Kathryn (1:09:01)
Yeah.
Oh, all night. Yeah. It was,
yeah. And it was like the day I started listening. I was like, I'll listen to one before I go to sleep. I listened to like six of them that night until like four in the morning. I finished it the next day. I finished this entire series in 24 hours. I'm like, and I'm just, oh my God. So I don't recommend that. I don't recommend doing that.
Gina (1:09:25)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Okay.
Kathryn (1:09:41)
But it was
so good. It was genuinely so well made. Like I do recommend it. I just am like going through it. And I will say, I wanna be very clear. I do believe the person who said, like the person who admitted to it, I do believe it was really him.
Gina (1:10:01)
Me too.
That was, found
that to be the most stressful part when they were talking, when they decided they wanted to talk to him and it was agreed upon and then they were talking about how they were gonna go about it, like should we call the phone number, should we email? And for a while they were talking about Monica like, like going at, like physically finding this man in the world and confronting him in person. I would panic so hard, let alone a Zoom call that would.
Kathryn (1:10:06)
Mm-hmm.
God. Yes.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Gina (1:10:27)
I'd be so scared, but confronting a person like that, it's like somebody who catfished who is like the, by this point in the series, he's built up to be like this really kind of malignant person, which like winds up not really being the case, but you're led to believe that he's kind of like this evil figure and being willing to go and just find them and be like, hey, what the hell? my.
Kathryn (1:10:29)
my God.
Mm-hmm.
I agree that listening to them brainstorm how to approach us gave me so much anxiety. I felt like I was in a pre-client meeting with like a very scary client.
Gina (1:10:59)
I know.
Yes!
Yeah, my gosh.
I'm glad that we can have this shared experience now because I needed someone to talk to you about it. So thank you for letting me put you through hell.
Kathryn (1:11:14)
I know, was like, I
was like screaming at you via text, like, I can't tell you that I love this podcast because I'm in so much pain. Like so much pain, but it is so good.
Gina (1:11:29)
Yeah, I totally get it.
Well, thank you for debriefing with me.
Kathryn (1:11:34)
Thank you for giving me something to debrief. ⁓
Gina (1:11:37)
No
problem. Well, I'm looking forward to seeing you for Femme Fatale Month. Have a great life in the meantime. I don't know why I'm saying that. I'm going to text you like as soon as this is done. But as a quick reminder, if you listening have any stories that you want us to read on the podcast, whether it's like, you know, a story you wrote yourself or a real life experience you had somewhere, or just, you know, like what your f-
Kathryn (1:11:43)
Me too. Yeah, I know, I'm gonna go take a nap. I know.
Gina (1:12:04)
favorite flavor of Pop-Tart is, we're open to anything and everything, for the most part, within reason, at iscreamyouscreampod@gmail.com Please don't catfish us.
Kathryn (1:12:10)
Yup.
I'm like,
immediately after talking about Beth's dead, there are some parameters. Email us as yourself.
Gina (1:12:16)
Yeah, yeah, so we do have some boundaries, but if you email us,
yeah, ask yourself, we can tell you what those boundaries are. But anyway, until next time, little spoons, keep it cool.
Kathryn (1:12:26)
Yeah.
and keep it creepy.
